In episode 5 of Crazy F'in Retail, the Podcast Brennan and Alice discuss the Harvard Business Review Article - 8 Ways Leaders Delegate Successfully (link below) by Deborah Riegel (8/15/2019).
In episode 5 of Crazy F'in Retail, the Podcast Brennan and Alice discuss the Harvard Business Review Article - 8 Ways Leaders Delegate Successfully (link below) by Deborah Riegel (8/15/2019).
Support the show (https://www.patreon.com/crazyfinretail)
retail is crazy. Your leadership doesn't have to be. This'll is crazy f in retail with Brennan and Alice.
Welcome to another episode of crazy fuckin retail. Tonight, Brennan and I will be discussing another Harvard Business Review article called Eight Ways Leaders Delegate successfully by Deborah Grayson Regal Brennan, Do you want to kick us off?
Absolutely. You know, Alice, you and I, we have a lot of great conversations around delegating and the need for us as individuals, as leaders and for our teams to be armed with the resource is and the knowledge and the training to do it better. This article, the second or third sentence, delegating more responsibility for decision making increases, productivity, morale and commitment, all of which impact company culture. So, you know, I'm gonna give it right back to you, Alice, because you had some great points that you wanted to talk about. What do you want to lead with today?
So we always talk about how delegating is key. Um, you know, not long ago, we talked about instead of talking about delegating, why not say empowering and that kind of hit home for me? But at the end of the day. We struggle with empowering our secondary leadership, our team, because of the resistance that we have as leaders. So about 1/4 way do the article. There's a line that says before leaders can successfully and effectively delegate the need to understand their own resistance, and something that I even go through myself is. Sometimes I have a hard time delegating it to somebody because I physically didn't train them on the expectations or what I need them to do. I have trust issues or you know what? I could do it better myself, and I tend to overwhelm myself because I hold onto every single task for dear life and I don't let it go. So there's a tendency where I have of being a very controlling leader. But how does that help in my day to day life within my role? And how does that motivate my team to want to do more so understanding that we have to let go of that control? Sometimes we have to trust but also realized, Why are we acting that way right? It could be a lack of training on our part. Maybe I never really trained this person on how to do it. Or maybe they did it once and they failed, and you don't want to give them another opportunity. But we're robbing their opportunity to be in the learning mode again. We talk about it time and time again is that they're not gonna learn it right away. Be patient, give him the opportunity. And in turn, it's going to help us delegate our workload and be successful leaders. So we're gonna go ahead and jump right into some of the bullet points that we've had and the first call out Izz, pick the right person. Um, you want to make sure that the person that you pick wants to do it. They want to learn more. They have the capacity to do so. And these shown interest running. What do you think
picking the right person is is definitely key, but I want to rewind a little bit. God, I hate to do this. I hate to always rewind, but you said something that just made my ears perk up. You talked about the resistance, right? I think that hate to do it, but I think there's a gift there. I think that often the resistance is not do to lack of training or lack of this or lack of something we've provided. I mean, I'm just thinking to myself, How often is the resistance related to your ego? So me, for instance, we all know that I love my Google sheets. Maybe there's a little bit of ego piece at play there where I don't want to delegate or share because that's part of my identity. Does that make sense? Alice? Oh, yeah. So how many times do we have managers or assistant managers or supervise? Or were Did we in these roles not delegate something off because it's a piece of our identity? I mean, what do you think? Do you think there's something there?
Definitely, You know, years and years and years and years ago I had somebody tell me, Don't share everything or you're going to lose your competitive edge. And at that point, I was like, Oh, yeah, you're right. I want to still be relevant. But as I progressed in my journey as a leader and going through different rules, that doesn't help at all. It backfires on you. You're robbing your team. The ability to grow with really elevates the level of leaders that you have around you. But it's true. It is ego based, right? Sometimes you might think, Well, there's two sides to the eagle like Oh, no, that's my identity. Or you could even think Well, if I delegate this off to somebody, are they gonna think that I'm stupid and I don't know how to do it? Or are they gonna think I'm lazy? Right? But that's not the case. It's always ensuring that your setting, the expectation and the wise behind why you are actually delegating this to them and be very purposeful in their development. Well,
yeah, you know, I think there's one more thing there. I think there's one more piece to it. I think there's another component of delegating. What if I delegate this to them and they get better than me? Does that ever happen? All I've had those thoughts, I think for sure. I know for sure, right. And so that's why the gift, the gift? I think it's I love going back to your Shrek analogy, for I don't even know what episode that was on. But it's, you know, we always start on the surface. It was like for three or four. This podcast gives us a platform to take off their your four layers and really get to the gift at the center of it and what you said earlier on about, um, about not giving away all your secrets. Well, that comes from a really fixed mindset place, right? I think that when you get are in a safe environment in a safe culture where I know that, Alice, if your success your success does not take away from my success, there is enough success to go around, and there's so much success out there that we could never possibly capture it all. So let's share our gifts with each other because you're gonna put your own twist on it, and then you might pass it back to me, and it might come back to me even more refined and better than when I sent it off. See, that's the growth mindset. I think that's where that's where we have to peel back those layers as managers and human beings and say, Where is this coming from? What is my resistance? Where's my resistance coming from at its core? And is it because of your ego. Is it because you're afraid that they're going to get better? Or they look at you like you're stupid? Or maybe your boss will say, Well, if Alice passed that off, she must not know how to do it. So I have about Brennan. Must be better, right? Is that what our insecurities are? Is that what the resistance is? And once we get past that, I mean going back to that last episode. The self awareness is a leadership superpower. This is that where that superpower shows its face again. Because when you're self aware and you can identify why you're not doing something, then you can move, get past it. But you have to be courageous enough to admit that you have what your core issue is. So now that we're now that that gift is out there now that we're past that, um, picking the right person, you know, we had some great examples that we talked about Alice. Um, you know, I've talked about picking the right person from a development standpoint, and then I think you've talked about picking the right person from, like, a challenge standpoint. Each of these questions in this article So who needs to develop these skills? Who has the capacity? Who has shown interest, who is ready for a challenge, Right? You really have done it. If I identify why you're delegating in the first place. Alice, did you want to talk about the challenge piece?
Sure. Um, you know, you know, for our listeners. And, you know, if you look at this bullet, but number one on this article, it's its task based and situational base. So it's not a cookie cutter. It could definitely be in any scope, off challenge and task that Brenda and I are just gonna talk about, So, you know, this past holiday. So about what, 34 months ago, I had a veteran store manager that owned a phenomenal holiday. Dr. And she ran with it. And, you know, um, actually, but you and I were on the same team and I had an amazing team captain, and this store manager ran with it. And it wasn't a new skill she needed to learn. It was I knew that she had a ton of energy, a ton of passion behind it that I knew she could rally the team to move as one toe obtain one result. And that was just to be number one in the in the company, right? But it wasn't a skill set that she needed to learn. I just knew she was the right person for this challenge to get the entire team to be bought in because she just used this energy and fight behind her.
This reminds me, I think, just to kind of reframe the delegating process. My boss has always said fingers in everything handed nothing right? And so really getting to the core of why you're delegating. So, Alice, you delegated this to that manager because we had to deliver. It was highly competitive for a great cause. All the money went to the special Olympics. I'm looking at the plaque right now. I pulled it off on my bookshelf for this episode because I knew we were gonna talk about this. We were number one, right? And it was because of managers like yours. Managers like mine managers, like every other manager from the areas in on our in our group, we needed to deliver and we had to deliver in a short time span, right? And so we put the best person for the job in that position, and that's why you chose your person. On the flip side, I've talked before about utilizing delegate delegation as a way to develop someone skills. So the other end of the spectrum is, you know, we don't have. I think it was What was it? A six. How long was that drive that we did for the Youth Foundation? Alice Was it like
he was about six weeks, six or seven weeks? Yeah,
six or seven weeks. So we had six or seven weeks and we had to deliver and we couldn't get behind and because we wanted to be number one and that ended up happening well. On the flip side, I wanted to develop the hiring skill early on as a manager with some of my assistant managers, so that time was essentially unlimited. I didn't have six weeks. I wasn't time bound. It was as this person grows and is ready, this is a new manager. Let's help them learn how to hire. We started off using. I delegated off the first part of the hiring process. The phones Korean process, Um, which is relatively easy, relatively safe. You ask a list of questions off a piece of paper and write the answers down. If you feel like they have answered the questions in a way that stayed, that shows that they would be a strong employee for our store, then you move him onto an interview. If not, you don't. So we went through the phones. We utilized the phone screen process and I said, Let's call her Jessica. I said, Jessica, let's Ah, you're in charge of the phone screen process. I'm gonna teach you how to do it. We went through it, and then I just said, Jessica, can you do? I'd like for you to do 5 to 10 phones grains a week, And through that, she threw that repetition. She built experience and then eventually will call her Jessica again. Jessica was ready to go over to the first interview process, So then she sat in with my M. I. T. On a week's worth of interviews, watching my M I t. My manager in training do the interviews and then the manager in training flipped it and watched her do the interviews. And then Jessica was in charge of the first interview and Brandon was up. We'll call him Brandon Brandon, then did the phone screens. And Jessica did the first interviews, right? And so that's utilizing delegation as a as a development tool. But again, there's this multiple ways to utilize it and just it's just it's just about the situation you're in. So the next point is being clear about what the person is responsible for and how much autonomy they have. Alice and I think we believe that delegations a great tool, a great skill to have. But it's definitely underutilized. So as we go through, these points were going to kind of talk about, you know, whether or not that's the biggest opportunity area from our experience back to the first bullet point picking the right person. I haven't really seen that being the number one red flag as to why people don't delegate or where delegating goes wrong. What do you think, Alice?
That's definitely true, and I kind of want to jump to the next one, cause I think this is where we see a ton of opportunity and it talks about their clear about what the person is responsible for and how much aton me they have. That's the 1st 1 and the number three is. They describe the desire results in detail. This includes setting clear expectations about the outcome, what it is, how the task fits into the bigger picture, why we're doing it, and the criteria for measuring success what she'll look like when done well. So I think the second of the third. Ah, bull points kind of go together, and I think we have a big opportunity there about clipping clear, um, setting clear expectations and what the desired outcomes look like.
I agree. I agree. 100% I think, you know, can you talk a little bit about what you did? Because it's fresh in our mind. We're coming off of, ah, one of the best performances in the holiday drive. We were obvious, obviously, number one as a team. So what did you do? How did you set your manager up for success there? What are those conversations sound like? And maybe you could talk a little bit about where some things have gone wrong in other situations that helps you set this event up for success.
So before I made the announcement that this individual be my team captain. I called and said I would like to represent you as a team captain. Is this something you could handle during the busiest time of the year, which is our holiday season? This Dr started right before Black Friday into the six weeks of the craziness of holiday. And this individual worked in an outdoor outlet that is insane during the holidays. So I asked the right question, and then I asked, This individual might Do you want to do it? Is it something there like, Yes, you don't say no more. I am all for it. I said, All right, so let's talk about what I need from you. I need you to rally the entire team and ensure that every single store will need to pull their weight and perform. You know, this individual decided to split my entire district up and create team captains for a smaller group. And she rallied all the team captains together and told him the exact same expectation that I told her so. It was very seamless process, because what I stated to her was what my expectations were, what, straight from my mouth toe out of her mouth to the other team captains within our district. We knew what the result was. We wanted to be number one. There was no second. There was no third. There was none of that. We needed to go out there and win. So from beginning to end, what she was going to represent, what the expectations were and what the desire result was was all within one conversation. It was very simple. There was no other color to it, but it was very direct. Brennan, you're part of our group within our holiday drive. I'm sure yours looked exactly the same as well.
Yes, very similar. And I want to just point out something. I want to make sure the listeners don't miss it. You asked her permission first? Yes, right. How many times again, being a leader Early on, I think we've all made mistakes. How many times do we just go and delegate something without even asking if they want it? E. I mean, how shitty is that? Can you imagine having something delegated to without you even wanting to do it or understanding why you're doing it? Or how it connects back to the bigger picture? I love that you asked her permission. And so really, that's a That's a key step in this delegation process. But I want to talk about the flipside. I'm gonna use my same example, and I'm gonna I'm gonna make frame it as if it went wrong. And again, I'm sure you've seen this also, Alison, I'm sure we've probably made the same similar stumbling as a manager early on. So let's say I need to. My boss comes in and says, Brennan, you need to hire two people a week for the next five weeks. You're understaffed. We've got holiday around the corner. All right, All right, boss, I got it. Here's how I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna delegate the hiring process of we're going to get it done. Okay, boss. Boss leaves and I go over to will use the same fictional names again. Jessica. All right. Boss said we have to get to hires a week for the next five weeks. We're behind. We got tolerated. Holiday around the corner. In order to do this, I need you to do the phone screens. So that's what you're in charge of. OK, two weeks go by. Jessica hasn't done any phone screens. I didn't break that. I didn't break the task down. I didn't talk about what success looks like. I kind of said what our expectation was right to hires a week for five weeks. But I didn't necessarily talk about what her specific role in the stores success look like and how her her success contributed to the stores success. Have you ever had that happen, Alice? Were you having a conversation with maybe a Ah store manager or someone in the past where we're they've talked about? Well, I told that person to do it. You ever have that come up?
I've heard that my entire career. And also I think I've said it before. Well, I've told this person to do it, but at the end of the day, it comes down
to what I did wrong. Absolutely. And that's kind of you know where I want to go next. So I agree with you, though I don't think it's picking. The right person is the biggest challenge that our leaders have. I think that it's helping them understand what they're responsible for, how much autonomy they have and does. Describing the desired results in deal detail. Actually, you know what? I'm just gonna throw out. Then the point Number two scratched The How much autonomy to have. I think it's fully the biggest area of opportunity for our stores and for any leadership retail leader, myself. Included is to describe the desired results in detail. And here's the key. What is success look like? What is the criteria for success? And when you're successful, what does it look like? Paint the picture. It is detailed as you can be. Help. Then help connect What overall? So what? Their success. How their success connects to the bigger picture success that I think is where the breakdown is. The next piece they established checkpoints, milestone stones and junctures for feedback. I mean to me, I'll just be honest as a store manager, I learned is very quickly, and I learned it during the closing process. All right, when you're closing down your store, that's what you're counting the tills for about half the time and so you have to delegate. I mean, I think that's the delegation. That close, I think is is one place where every manager gets experience or very quickly. But what I learned is that I would I would start with saying we used to have a list I think we had like, I don't remember how I did it. We had a list, so I would give one person like I'd give each person like 3 to 5 items. But what would happen is I'll be counting the drawers until, like, 9 30 then I would start following up, and what I would find is that some people were ahead and they just stopped working and some people were way behind and they were not gonna finish their tasks by the time we need to get out of there. So that's what I learned really Early on is to establish the checkpoints and milestones for feedback so that they neither feel micromanaged or under lead. I used to check in with some people every five minutes. Give me a status update, right? We all have that one person in our store who is the slowest sweeper, or they miss all the little extra cheese or dust bunnies under the under the fixtures or walls. So let's check in every five minutes. Hey, John, tell me when you raise your hand when you're done sweeping that section over there. I'm gonna come over there. I just want to check it out real quick. And then before you move on, just let me check that one out. That way, you catch it early or Hey, let me see. Grab you. You know, you're in charge of folding T shirts tonight. Can you go around and collect all the T shirts? But real quick. Can you bring one over here and let's just fold it together And let's just make sure we're on the same page with the expectation. What do you think, Alice? What have you used? When did you learn to establish checkpoints as a manager?
You know, I think you kind of hit it on the head about. We do have employees that are the slowest at sweeping or we cut the corners and we're always going tohave. That kind of employee on our team, it's It's inevitable, right? We have all types of employees within our team. But you know what? I just think back of this situation with the challenge that we had during holiday, especially for a very high performer making sure we're not micromanaging because I could have easily called this store manager in the morning and at night saying, How are we doing? Why are you doing this? And consistently badgering this person? But because this individual was such a high performer and was a leader of the market in the district that I made sure I let off. I only leaned in when I saw there was a slight opportunity where you see somebody in a different group underperforming and all I would do is knock on the door or pick up the phone and say, Hey, I noticed this individual is struggling. What can I do to assist you with assisting this individual? That could be two states away? What are they going through? So let's talk it through. You know, you gotta understand your employees at all times. What are they good at? What are they not good at? They're not good at this. And make sure you check in there. Great. It just celebrate them. Right? So you got to know every single individual and ensure that your coaching them in the right way is special when they're being empowered to run something for you?
Absolutely. And I think that you know some people very early on. How long have you worked with that manager that you put in charge of the drive?
Funny thing, is this individual usedto work with me in the past? About 56 years ago. She was actually one of my secondary leaders. So we worked together for a very, very, very long time. You know, I knew what made her tick. I knew how she wanted feedback. You know how she wants to be celebrated. I knew this individual very well.
Essentially, what I'm guessing is with that individual. And this is just a great example for the listeners. Is that I'm sure very early on, when that individual worked as a secondary leader in Alice's store, I'm sure you didn't give him a cz much space as you did for this, right? Right. I e. And I think that over time, that person has delivered day after day, week after week, month after month, year after year, they have delivered. And so as they deliver and and achieve the desired outcome, you know, I think that you can take a step back and take a step back. I think management is a lot like and Maybe this is a terrible analogy, but the newest people you're you're standing right next to him. You're practically touching them shoulder to shoulder, right? And then when they start doing something right, you take a step away and then you take another step away. Oh, step too far away. Step in closer because they dropped the ball there, right? And then you step away some more and more. And the Maury experience they become, the further away you get. So, like Alice with your example, I bet that you could have just delegated in the beginning and not followed up at all. The entire drive and the result would have been the same.
Exactly. You know, it's It's like, you know, the analogy that I always use is like having an infant. An infant does not know how to do anything but eat sleep and poop rate. But when that infant becomes a toddler and learns how to walk for the first time, you know they are crawling. Then they're holding onto your fingers and tryingto lift themselves up or there trying to take their first step. But they fall down its exact same process. When we think of training and delegating, right? It's those tiny baby steps when you know that they're gonna fall, but you're gonna help them get back up. So that's just you know, as you were saying, that was like, Oh, my God. It's like I'm teaching my little niece howto walk for the first time.
Yeah, and then eventually, eventually there. Better there Faster than you. All right, they're beaten. You on a foot race or race around the block in the bike, right? I mean, eventually, they're gonna master it, and they're gonna be teaching you some thanks. And so I think that's a great analogy. So the next piece we're gonna talk about was really howto level up the delegating process. Alice, do you want to kind of hit bullet 0.67 and eight?
Sure. So Number six states, they encourage new creative ways for team members to accomplish goals. It's important for Della gators to set aside their attachment. So how things have been done in the past so that they can invite, recognize in reward novel approaches, outwork. So let me tell you, I have the biggest problem with controlling the expectations and the desired result. Very, very very controlling. I am. So when I read this, it just gives me a nice reminder to not be so controlling. But, you know, I think of the challenge that we had is our holiday drive. The process was a fantasy draft where I picked leaders, picked area managers on random. I guess you could say kind of very similar to a football fantasy draft. You know, we just pick different teams not in the same region to really work, you know, with different leaders that we've never done in the past. So when I told my leader that I did this, she took it upon herself. She goes, you know what? We're gonna do the same. We're going to the same. We're gonna defied this district into four groups. And I'm going to empower some of my leaders that have been great performers to motivate a smaller group. And I said, Okay, let's see how that works. And obviously we did a phenomenal job. So it was very It was very enjoyable for me to watch from afar and how fun it was for her to take that exact same process, tweeted as very managers and did it herself. within my market. She didn't have a lot of people that she needed to reach out to just a small core group, but she was able to power other people to impact the market. And that was just amazing sight to see because we had fun. We made it fun during the busiest time of the year, so that goes into my next point, Wertz says. They create a motivating environment. It kind of goes hand in hand right now with empowering my veteran leader that took this drive from my market and then divided the district up two different team captains and did the same process. And it was just an amazing sight. Tow watch, how motivated she waas and how passionate she was behind this project.
No, that's a great point, Alice one going back to the creative New ways. Creative ways for team members to accomplish the goals. If you started a step one and picked the right person identified who's ready for a challenge or whether, Skills said, is that obviously, if you're using it as an opportunity to develop someone, you don't want to just go say today you're gonna do your froze first phone screen. Just make up the questions and let's see if we can get some people in here. We want to be careful with some things right, but encourage creativity. And when you have a strong leader and someone that you've trust and you know that that you're really truly empowering to achieve success, step back, disconnect from the situation and just see what they do, because you can always step back in and course correct if it gets too far outside of the lines. But like we've said before, encourage your people to color outside of the lines Go where we haven't been before. And let's design something new because that's how I think that's how you really helped them take ownership of whatever it is they're leading, as well as discover new ways to achieve an even better result. Um, the next piece you talked a lot about motivating environment. I mean, that's an easy one. If you wanna win, you gotta celebrate success and recognize, recognize when to be a cheerleader or a coach when to step in or step back. I mean, those are both key points because really points of one through five help you understand how to delegate successfully. And I'm telling you, store managers and area manager anyone that's listening to this podcast right now, if you just do one through five, you're good. You're gonna get it done. Good. Solid check complete. But if you want to really level up and go from good to great, you've gotta embrace 67 and my favorite eight. You know, a common theme for this podcast is creating a safe space for your team. A safe environment, emotionally safe place for your team. And a big part of that is tolerating the risks and mistakes and using them as learning opportunities rather than as proof that they shouldn't have delegated in the first place. That's directly from the article. I didn't make that up. And I can't tell you how toxic it is for leaders to delegate something out. Empower someone to make something great or better than it was before. And then the moment they dropped the ball, step in and take it away. Shit. You should've passed it off in the first place and you'd be further ahead than you are at that moment cause you got this person hopes up. You got them all brought in. They took ownership and then you knocked him down. So you took him from 50 to 100 down to 25. You should have just left their ass at 50. I think you know, I've seen that happen, and I just can't stress enough go into when you delegate something off, regardless of if it's if it's the situation with my phone screens. Example or Alice's holiday example, this manager could work for you for 10 years. And guess what? There's still going to make mistakes. I mean, what are your thoughts, Alice? Anything you wanna add there,
right? You know, earlier I made that analogy with an infant crawling and then walking, and I'm trying to think of any toddler that learned howto walk the moment they stood up. I I don't think that's really all right. I think kids fall. I think you know, you have to put, you know, you have to put little, you know, plugs into the outlet so they don't electrocute themselves or all the corners. You want to make sure it's safe because you know your child in a fall, but you let them walk eventually. Now, there you know 2345 years old and they're running right waiting. Hinder their ability to walk, right? So we can't just take it away. I think there's a difference if if if somebody you delegate to and saying you know what, Brennan? I'm a little overwhelmed. Um, do you mind if if you could take over right? It's different if the employees ass like, Hey, I'm struggling, I'm a little overwhelmed. Do you mind if I take a little bit of a step back? Then that's when you could step in. But you have to allow them to fail. You know, What's our other podcast called Good leaders, our good learners. If our leaders are in the learning mode, you've gotta allow them to fail. You can't Caudle them. You can't micromanage them. You can't rep remem them when you're giving them the opportunity to do it. It's part of the process, right? It's part of the process. There's great learnings that come out of failing, and you got to be able to tolerate those wrists. You gotta be okay with those mistakes as long as they learn. But don't take it away from them unless they ask. I need help
going back to your Tyler example. I mean, have you ever burned yourself as an adult, Alice? Yes, of course. My five year old burned himself the other day. I'm 34. I burned myself recently. So 29 years I've been getting burned. You're gonna mess up, you're gonna make mistakes. That doesn't mean I can't cook. I mean, if your manager in your holiday during your holiday drive that you've worked for worked with for is it safe to say 10 plus years?
Oh, gosh, no. Maybe like two and 1/2 3
two and 1/2. Alright. Alright. Alright. Two and 1/2 3 If your manager for two and 1/2 3 mirrors that you have put complete trust and faith in drops the ball and you take it away right away.
That's not okay,
but I think we see leaders do that all the time. I think that we see leaders and you know one thing. I learned I was having a conversation with someone and we were talking about what we're talking about. We were talking about We were talking about the hiring process and we were talking about how much time we invest in two employees before they get into the building, you do a phone screen, you do two interviews, you reference checks. You really careful. But then they get in the building and the investment goes down. Instead of doing a 30 minute interview, we do a couple of minutes of feedback and then we're done. Then we talked about will. How much time do we do? You and I invest in each other, right? When we go, we'll have our long conversations about your development. Do they help you? Of course they do. Well, Do you do that for them? Oh, no. Well, why not? So you know, if you wantto you've got to make sure that your own, you understand that delegating something off is not saying Go do my job. It's about making someone better, whether they've worked for you for three years or whether they've been in there month for 30 days, been in their role for 30 days. It's about making them better and in turn growing the helping the store succeed and helping your area succeed and helping your organization succeed. So I would just say that we've got to make sure that We have the right mindset going into before we delegate, and we're looking at it as an investment in our people. That's all I've got, Alice, you got anything else you want to add?
You know, I think I've said it almost every single episode. But it comes down to you, you know, is what you create. And I think another thing is just be patient, you know, it's it takes time to build these skill sets. It takes times to get better. So I think, you know, just be a good leader and always be in the learning mode and just have some patients. And that's all I have.
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